Data Challenges in Telecommunications

Hi. Thank you for having me. I'm delighted to be here today. Well, that's fantastic, Sonya.

Absolutely. So I will say, initially, that my husband will probably disagree because he hears me way too much. So I'm delighted to speak to other people who want to listen to me. I am, as you mentioned, the senior manager of discovery and information at T-Mobile.

And I have been with the company the new combined company since for the last three years, I was formerly at Sprint where we were acquired. And then I started even a little bit before that at Nextel back in the late nineties.

So I've always been in telecom, always been in legal in this eDiscovery world.

At Sprint, I had the majority role of pretty much doing everything, writing records retention policies, issuing legal hold, being a thirty b six witness, arguing with attorneys and the government. I am not an attorney. I have chosen not to become one. For the sake that I can just really go off and kinda tell people, and the worst thing to me is that they can fire me. But I did a lot of work of building some practices, workflows, the limited staff, limited budget, not having any history in the legal department at all, so a lot of it is self taught. And really leaning on peers within the industry and throughout different organizations.

So it's me in a nutshell. I'm a proud global advisory member and the ASITS board, and I like to speak at different events just so I can kind of gain knowledge and learn some things at the same time. Thank you for the introduction and the background. I'm fascinated by the telecom industry.

So, generally speaking, it clearly it fluctuates every minute by every minute. But we on average in the litigation team. We are most employees when we're doing collections, and that's what my team primarily works on. You know, we're averaging a good fifty to a hundred gigabytes of just volumes of emails, not including other applications and chat locations and just strictly email.

And most employees like me have been around for a long time. You know, they've been around ten, fifteen years. They have mounds and mounds of data. I can say that we fortunately have built in some good records policies and retentions and audits and tracking that has kind of helped our data be minimized into the right buckets and the right parameters and classifications it took a long time to get there, but I'm glad that we put the work in because now the fruits are paying off as volume levels continue to get bigger, bigger.

I know that we are a Microsoft shop. So clearly, we're using OneDrive. We also use clearly SharePoint. We're using Slack.

We're using Webex. The combined companies between both legacy T-Mobile and Sprint just made it two big companies coming together, and we didn't get rid of anything. So and all the legacy companies that we had internally I think we're up to about three or four million Slack messages a day. You know, we're sending five, six hundred thousand emails every day.

So it's a totally a volume thing. But luckily, we have kind of some good processes built into the workflow, so the data goes where it's supposed to go. And I'm a big proponent of making sure that we have educated people so that they understand that their data is going is discoverable.

Which is a big, big proponent of people knowing what to do and how to manage it. Especially with three to four million Slack messages per day, And that's a that's a large task selling you to make sure that people are educated at everything they're doing is discoverable. So You've been you've been there a very long time as you noted and, you know, going back to the old sprint next hell days. By the way, the quote and quote world headquarters of Sprint is around the quarter from here in Northern Park. Old sprint campus. Right? And I remember the two way walkie talkies on the nextel that was, like, very in very ingenious, right, back in the day in the nineties.

Yeah. So I really think it's to me, it is the volume. That that definitely is a factor. I'm less worried about the factor because if you have good processes around it, you can manage that.

My thing really is about all the different areas of data and where people store it and just our rules around the governance of it. So for example and I use this example at work. Throughout my history, I've used different applications, different software, some are legacy systems, Some are decommissioned, some are not decommissioned.

But if you think over the past twenty years, if someone was to collect from me, they would have a hard time figuring out me because I've been so fluid. And I think it's really just the opportunity of where that data sit and being in the legal department, keeping abreast of where it is. So every week, I have a meeting with someone who is not in the legal department. And that's purpose and that's intentful.

And I do that for myself so that I can learn. I'm like, what is IT doing over there? And what is HR rolling out and what is the sales team doing and what you know, if they're using Salesforce or they're using whatever application they're using, by the time it trickles to me in discovery and litigation, it's generally years ago or six months ago, And so I'm always behind the eight ball. So part of my own mantra is really to get out there and learn.

But it's really just being interested in How does it work? Where does it work and who has access to it?

Absolutely. So the company has a completely dedicated team of hundreds of people that that is exactly their primary function. They do nothing but subpoena, process subpoenas, twenty four hours a day, three sixty five, they don't get a break, it's around the clock shop, of storing that data, and it could be as simple as, you know, I need to track And there's a civil side and there's a criminal side, so that's kind of divided.

Luckily, I sit on the civil side so it's not as gross and bad, but there could be, you know, I'm trying to find my kid or I'm trying to do this or I'm trying to do that. And it's really kind of complicated. I often say that it's kind of like, the back of an old time watch where it has all of these triggers moving it, and it has to move seamlessly because the customer doesn't understand all the data replication, all the upstreams, all the workflows, all the people who need access to the data so that they can present the product in the service. So part of my job is really creating what I've done recently is create these profiles so that when we're in litigation, we can understand how does that work?

Where does it connect to? Where does it connect from? Do we need that data? And how do the customers react?

Clearly, privacy is a big big big component of what we do, we are heavily regulated, is another thing. But also a lot of employees, we're required to take certain trainings every couple of months so that if you have access to certain data type, particularly the customers, we value customer information We protect it. Certain people do not have access. And if you have access, it's not indefinite.

You know, we have to go to routine audits all the time every ninety days, do you still need access to this type of data? And we take it variously, There's a lot going on there to unpack. You're talking before about process, about rules, about being heavily regulated, and certain trainings to take for a lot of the employees or people that are listening to this podcast right now who may not be in a heavily regulated industry like yours, who may not be in as large of a company as yours. I get the sense that there are really valuable lessons that still can be learned for smaller organizations who still struggle with compliance with process, with rules.

Yeah, the first thing I would definitely say is write down your objective and your goal. I mean, it's business one zero one. What do you wanna accomplish? And I don't care if you are the owner of a bakery.

You have a goal where else you would be The owner of a bakery, so start with your objectives, go back to the old business plan of what do I wanna accomplish. And if your goal is to make a certain amount of dollars in a certain amount of time, great. Go back and re engineer how do I do that? What are the rules around it?

If if you're not in a regulated industry and many people are not. Many people I know actually leaving big corporations branching out on their own and starting their own businesses because they have the experience. They understand what it takes to run a business. But start with those basics of what do you wanna accomplish, and then surround yourself with the right people to help you get there.

I'm a big proponent of if I may not be the smartest in the room, but I know a lot of smart people. And that's one of the reasons why I've never become an attorney because I don't wanna be one. I know enough of them in different practice areas also. It's definitely a advantageous, beneficial thing to a person to have people of well rounded backgrounds, diversity matters.

Whether you are talking patent law, if you're talking commercial law, if you're talking HR law, you don't have to be a big multinational company to actually run a business effectively. So make sure that you have the right advice around people, and if you don't, then seek that first. Because if you don't have your foundation covered, I could care less what your business is. You're not gonna be successful, and it's not gonna feel good when you're trying to do because there's a lot of work to get it done and to set those rules.

And sometimes you have to be the person that says, No. We're not doing that. And but you have to be able to explain why. I love all that.

Well, I definitely have great managers, and I've always had great management, which has been a blessing to me. I probably wouldn't have been as successful if I had managers that didn't really support me. And they didn't want me to be my own person. No one has ever really stopped me from doing that, which is I appreciate.

So for those that have that problem, I would say find a new manager. If you don't have a manager or vice president or somebody that's in your corner, they don't have to know everything that you know My boss doesn't know half of what I do. That's not her job. That's what she pays me to do, but what she does is she trusts me.

So that part you gotta start with. And if you don't have that, you definitely need that. And as I'm climbing as I climb up the ladder and I talk to different people in the organizations and really some outside the organization, some of our outside counsel, whether they're the partner, with their name on the monarchy. I'm like, I don't care where you went to high school and where you went to college.

And I don't care if you went to not believe school or not, I know what I know and you can't take that from me. So what we can do is figure out a common ground. We're all working towards a solution, and you really really just have to paint the story. Tell the picture, it's almost like about presenting a case on a trial, get your evidence, present your facts, tell the story, back it up, and it's as simple as that.

And it could be a small as a case. I've had a case where someone sued us in small claims years ago for one dollar, and I just was appalled quite honestly, I'm like, I'll just give you at fifty dollars, like, not to show up. And the customer politely and not politely some times said to me, it's not about the money. I just wanna see you guys show up.

And and I understood that. But what I did ultimately, and years later, he came back, and he was like, you're the only person that ever listened to me. And I said, what's the problem now, Joe? And so we would just work out.

So he never sued us again. He was a serial litigant against us up until he had met me, and I'm like, we're gonna stop this. I want to help you. I want you to be our customer.

If you don't if you know I'm going to be your customer, I can make that happen too. But I think I can help you, and I think no matter where you are in the organization, whether you're the CEO, whether you're the janitor, it doesn't matter. I think the store my message is to make sure that I'm telling the story and that I'm listening to what's being said so that we both meet in the middle. It's not a tug of war.

It's you know, we all gain if we're all going forward. You have a gift, Sonya. There's no question. Right?

Right? Absolutely.

Just I didn't know how things work, and I always asked why know, your mom used to say, so I've asked me all these questions. And I would always ask why. I didn't understand why certain things had to be a certain color. Or I would question my father, like, if the dictionary said the color black meant this, and I said, well, who wrote that?

And he would he didn't he was like, why that is what it is. And I'm like, but why is it that way? So I think for people who are genuinely already like that, it's easier for us. Plus I'm an extrovert.

It's easy for me to talk. It's easy for me because I'm nosy and I wanna understand everything.

For those, and I have been told that I can be a little direct and a little forceful. So for those who are more introverts like my husband, who is just sits back and lets me do everything. It's a little bit different and the task to get there and the steps that you to take you would have to do the soul searching. You have to sit with yourself and say, you know what?

I wanna get there. What is it gonna take Who do I look up to? Who do I think that has what I'm looking for? And I think also some of this comes with maturity You know, once you've when when you're young and you're starting, you just wanna grab grab grab grab, go go go.

And you may be missing the mark of like, where do you really wanna be? And quite honestly, it takes some soul searching of, like, okay. I want to establish this by this time and here's what I wanna be.

I've never met a person that has done exactly what they said they were gonna do when they were ten and wrote it out on a piece of paper, that life doesn't really happen like that and the people that I know. So what I tell people to do is give yourself some forgiveness, give yourself a little break tell yourself that you're in this phase now, reach out to people for the next climb and the next step.

Obtain that, and it you kinda put in hard work. That's the other part that a lot of people don't understand. It took me a long time sit where I'm sitting. It took me a many, many years of not getting a promotion of not being seen of having the crappiest jobs to run around and nobody saw me. But I knew at the end of the day that I had a powerful message, and then could be helpful, and I was part of that that kind of team that could say, like, I have a better suggestion, and you won't get passed over.

I've never known anyone who didn't get passed over, but you gotta stand still for what you believe in. And and that just starts from the root of who you are and what you wanna be.

So legal technology g is it sometimes scares me if I'm really being honest just because it could be. Oh, there's so much out there that it can be overwhelming.

And I think that's where I stay focused, like, okay, what am I solving for something? And then go out and analyze the tools that I need to get that project or that issue resolved. But if I'm thinking out, you know, ten years, twenty years out, like, what is my design for the company? What do I want it to look like?

What, you know, the visionary stuff that's a little more fun. And so I think you have to balance kind of, like, your critical daily needs and what technology and what tools are out there to solve your current problems. But then when you again, when you give yourself that little bit of grace and you got five minutes to think, like, If I could do this by myself, and I could have my magic wand, what would I have? That becomes easier.

And so I think for me, the technologies that are out there that are on the cusp of, you know, artificial intelligence and reading, you know, messages and geolocations and all of those things. It's already out there, but I'm almost a little hesitant to figure out Is it gonna be too creepy or is it just gonna be just enough? And I think that's a balance between kind of, like, what do you really want it to do? Like, most people want technology to help them, but they don't wanna be replaced, and they don't wanna feel like it's taking over.

So to me, it's a fine balance I think overall, for the company, clearly, we're a telecom company, so we like technology.

I think we just have to be careful about how much we deploy, how fast it is, what we're gonna do about it, and the safety around it because Most technology that's used for good can also be tweaked for bad. So you also have to manage it. And I think that's the only thing that really scares him about technology is just the management and the oversight of the management. Who's checking the checker?

What I say at work? I'm like, yeah. We have audits, and we have checks, but, like, who's checking the checker? And and is that transparent?

Is that, you know, if you have nothing to hide, then you'll let me see the report.

So this is really personal, but I wish we had an easy button for people's name changes, because that seems to be one of the things that people just don't think about a lot, but in a corporation, again, meat using myself. I have three different aliases ten different aliases.

And when I'm really trying to, for example, put me on a legal hold, I'm like, what person, am I putting on hold? So being really simple is like verifying the person, verification of who this person is. And I take it a little step further even just kind of is this person allowed to see this? Is this person in the right access group?

Is this person just the validation of a person keeps me up at night. I'm like, is that the same person? Is Bob Smith, that Bob Smith, or, you know, this lady got married, but now got divorced, but now she remarried her her ex husband, and now she's back again, and she's a contractor, and now she's an employee, that gets really messy. I call it noisy.

So if that can cut some of that noise and use software and technology to actually help do that, that would help me. And it's not necessarily an HR issue because they have their own requirements and reporting requirements.

I selfishly wanted for just the discovery team to say, I don't even need to go to HR because I have this magic wand, and now I can pinpoint exactly who I want to talk to, why I want to talk to much like the police pinpoint as for, you know, GPS location. It's a classic problem. I mean, it's I've been doing this over twenty years and I think it's been a problem for all of those twenty years where we've struggled to you know, resolve entities and figure out who is whom and whether or not two different names are the same person?

Yeah. I don't think that's going away, but that's one thing that, you know, it may not seem like, you know, the world's biggest problem, but it really puts I call it speed bumps. It's like the smallest speed bumps, sometimes it's the hardest. When you go over speed bump and it's hard and it tears your tire like that little bump caused all that damage, those little things matter, and I think that's where I kind of struggle at work sometimes, is if we don't have that foundation built and if we don't have good good baseline objectives of who has what and how are we using it, And, again, that it gets refreshed and that we go back and look at it again.

That's my biggest thing where I'm at. Now at work is Yes, we might have deployed a certain software and application for five or ten years. That's great. It's working.

There's nothing wrong with it. But shouldn't we go back and see if there's some upgrades? You know, if the company doesn't want to invest in the upgrades, then like, Are you okay with where we were five years ago? Because that's where we are still.

And and do we really wanna be there? And that's challenging when you're thinking of budgetary restrictions resource human resource restrictions. I'm not getting any more people on my staff. So and the work is piling in twice as much.

If you have an objective to produce overall operational efficiency because I need name normalization, then you're going out and you're trying to find a software provider or services provider that's gonna be able to help you solve that problem. Right. Absolutely. And, you know, quite honestly, I've been spoken to for many providers, they they're like, oh, you know, here's the new shiny button.

Here's a red button. Here's a purple button. You can't sell me because I already know what I want. And so they don't always get to go past the go side on the monopoly because I'm like, that's enough.

I've heard enough. And quite honestly, if they're doing a service to themselves, what they would do is already have asked me what do you want What do you need? How can I help you instead of just trying to sell at a person? I think that's the thing that some of the service providers do not do a good job of.

They're getting better at it, but really ask them and be okay with just the one thing that you can do for me. Most of the relationships that we have had or that I have had within the company on a vendor relationship started with a phone call because I liked the person. I liked who I was talking to. I kinda trusted what they said that they knew course, I validated and verified them, but they knew what they were talking about.

And it really started with the phone call with one project. One simple mess that I handed to them, and they took it, and years later they're still working on stuff. So I just tell people to be patient, you know, start with you don't have to know everything right away. I have told everyone in my career.

The end of this, it's gonna be like a ice sculpture, and it's gonna be this big old picture of me. But you gotta chisel away at it. Like, sometimes you're chiseling out of finger, and sometimes you're chiseling, you know, at the neck or the hair or the whatever. But the grand masterpieces, most of them take time.

It's it's not overnight, and some things might break in the process. And then you kind of change your method of what you wanna be. But again, if you have an a vision and an objective of what you wanna accomplish, then don't don't deviate from your mark.

It's funny. The those reading something once and I tell I tell this to my team as well. The best Pitch is not the pitch. It's to listen.

And a lot of people don't do that. They're just And I understand that they have their job, and they have their quota, and just like the people when they call the T-Mobile line, and they have a problem, and Someone's like, I'm gonna cancel my phone and we're like, okay. Go through that script. I tore the scripts up when I was at the call center training people.

I'm like, what are you doing? You're not listening, listen to what the person is saying, and you might have missed it because you're so busy trying to get your point across that sometimes you're missing it and that customer's gone. And some of them, they never come back. I'm like, there's nothing that we could be doing that the customer will not come back.

I mean, That comes from you not listening, and they're just fed up. So I understand that, and I appreciate that. So I do my best no matter who I'm talking to, to just pay attention. Be in that moment.

Don't be looking at your phone. Don't be doing all this. Pay attention. When you sit down at dinner, turn the TV off.

Pay attention, talk, like, get back to old basic skills. It's how the country was built in my opinion.

And I think we're missing some of it with technology. It's just so fast and there's so much at your hands, it just becomes overload and people you don't get the full story. Either. That oftentimes people get these clips, but nobody does research anymore.

Nobody picks up a book, the libraries, you know, nobody goes in the library and looks at what they do, but not as much as they used to because it's all in your hands and it's all so quick. So I'm a big proponent of, you know, Do the hard work. Go find out yourself and verify it. Don't take everything at face value.

Happy to do it again. I love giving my own personal thoughts, so I'm happy to do it. Thank you. Thank you, Sonya.